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I am currently involved in a selection process. I am looking for clear areas of separation between the two products based on current users knowledge and anyone that may have had a similiar experience in the recent past. All comments would be appreciated.

(Disclaimer: remember, I have had limited exposure to either solutions...so some observations listed below may be grossly erroneous due to first impressions and lack of depth of knowledge of systems...that is why I am asking, so no ranting when I mess up...I am quite aware of my lack of knowledge with these two systems.)

Observations so far:
1. General observations - Clear advantage to SAP with repect to overall depth of functionality in present solutions, but Oracle seems to be catching up quickly. While Oracle appears to have a slight advantage from the ease of use point of view, it appears that SAP has come a long way to become much more user friendly than in the past based on statements of long time SAP users.

Therefore, I would like to know if (in your opinion) you think the two will be best in class with similiar functionality and capability or do you think a "more mature" solution like SAP will be still be noticeably ahead in overall functionality in the 2-5 year time frame? (may be a loaded question on this particular board...)

2. Capital Projects - It appears to me that SAP had better functionality and more depth in this area and would be a clear favorite for larger projects...say >$1M...However, it appeared that SAP may be a bit tedious for the numerous smaller projects...say <$250k. (Lots of information to be setup and managed.) Oracle's approach seemed to be much less tedious to set up, but has me concerned with being able to manage larger projects.

Do you find the functionality of SAP with regards to smaller projects to be easy to use or a bit tedious?

3. Interfacing with field instrumentation (via HMI's). Are you using SAP or Oracle to trigger preventative or corrective tasks based on trigger points retrieved from field instrumentation? (vibration switches and spectrum thresholds, temperature readings, amps readings, pressure readings, cycles, throughput values, efficiency calculations, and etc.)

4. Linking work orders. Examples, A PM or PdM inspection results in a corrective work order or a Break down event happens and a emergency work order is completed, but will require 1 or more follow up work orders to repair correctly. This could be used to evaluate the effectiveness of the PM program or to insure that follow up work is executed appropriately. From my understanding, Oracle has the capability of "linking" independent work orders, while the SAP approach is to have a Parent Work Order that must remain open until all Child Work Orders are completed. Is this a correct interpretation and if so, do you find it to be functionally sufficient?

5. (Last one... a bit of a long posting.) Reliability functionality and metrics. How do you rate the functionality of the fault and cause codes? How do you like the analytical analysis and reliabilty metrics?

I will stop there for now and see how the responses go. It goes without saying that there are plenty of other areas that can be explored and of course the functionality of any system can only be best utilized if you have solid work processes in place. I have many questions about planning and scheduling, but will hold off for now.

I guess the last question would be: In your opinion, what are the most significant differentiating areas when it comes down to comparing these two solutions with respect to functionality and ease of use?

Thanks in advance for any comments...

Replies sorted oldest to newest

Oracle x SAP hmm...

I am not a SAP fan, thus I might be suffer from prejudice Big Grin

Okay SAP is a "accounting software" with a maintenance add-on.

Oracle is a database engine, and the Oracle Company jumped on the ERP/CMMS bandwagon with his own product.

About the database engine Oracle itself, it is the cadillac under de RDBMS (Relational Databa se Management Systems). You will pay big bucks $$$ for the database alone. There are vendors of CMMS/ERP systems that use an Oracle Back-end (databse engine) or another engine (Informix, SQL-Server, Interbase, Sybase etc..). Sometimes the client can choose on which engine the CMMS/ERP will run.

If you have an oracle-server farm, and the expertise in-house, it would be waste not using it.

About the price:

SAP = $$$$
Oracle = $$$$

SAP runs mostly Confused on Oracle, thus implementation of SAP = Sqr($$$$)

lets say:
Other CMMS + sql-server = $$
Other CMMS + Oracle = $$$$

First you have to look at the functionality of the CMMS, and that depends on which side your on:
1) maintenance
2) ICT
3) the beanies Big Grin

Disclaimer = this is my opinion and I am willing to defend it Cool
RM
Can you please tell us more about what financial system your company uses?

Why would you be looking at SAP-PM if your company did not run SAP ERP and why would you consider Oracle eAM if your company did not run Oracle ERP?

I suspect that this post is a plant by an SAP or Oracle account manager, but in any case I can tell you that at some point the argument for integration is overwhelming and that single fact hands the advantage to SAP and Oracle (and IFS, Lawson and Infor) as opposed to point solutions.

Technology and software upgrades move fast and paying for proprietary programming interfaces with each significant upgrade is not a worthwhile expenditure for most maintenance departments.

The functionality gap between the point solutions and the ERP players is still there but closing fast and most users do not access most of the point solutions power features anyway.

It would still be nice to hear from both camps to provide more details on the differences.

If this is a "real" post - my apologies. It just seems strange to allow the maintenance module to drive the ERP selection.

Terry O
RM
Sorry for confusing you Terry. I can assure you that the post is not a plant. We are in the stages of selecting an ERP package and the nice thing about our company is that they are really looking to get (and hopefully take to heart) the opinions of the guys on the floor and are really trying to get the most out of the "pending marriage" as it were. The reason that I am posting only mainteance questions here is because that is what the forum is and that is my area of expertise in this selection process. I PROMISE you that I would rather be at the plant! Maintenance...evolving into Reliability is hopefully moving into the direction of being a core business practice... I know that in our process, maintenance and reliability is getting well respected for the finiancial impact that they play in an asset intensive industry. Maintenance is certainly not driving the project, but is definitely participating.
The ultimate questions at hand are:

Are they closing the functionality gap?
Are they committed to closing the gap?
And is one or the other moving in a better direction?

Thanks for the replies and just so you know, I am only leaving my name off because I do not want to say definitively who I am while we are in the selection process...even though I am sure both could easily figure it out.
RM
quote:
Originally posted by svanels:
Oracle x SAP hmm...

I am not a SAP fan, thus I might be suffer from prejudice Big Grin

Okay SAP is a "accounting software" with a maintenance add-on.

Oracle is a database engine, and the Oracle Company jumped on the ERP/CMMS bandwagon with his own product.

About the database engine Oracle itself, it is the cadillac under de RDBMS (Relational Databa se Management Systems). You will pay big bucks $$$ for the database alone. There are vendors of CMMS/ERP systems that use an Oracle Back-end (databse engine) or another engine (Informix, SQL-Server, Interbase, Sybase etc..). Sometimes the client can choose on which engine the CMMS/ERP will run.

If you have an oracle-server farm, and the expertise in-house, it would be waste not using it.

About the price:

SAP = $$$$
Oracle = $$$$

SAP runs mostly Confused on Oracle, thus implementation of SAP = Sqr($$$$)

lets say:
Other CMMS + sql-server = $$
Other CMMS + Oracle = $$$$

First you have to look at the functionality of the CMMS, and that depends on which side your on:
1) maintenance
2) ICT
3) the beanies Big Grin

Disclaimer = this is my opinion and I am willing to defend it Cool


svanels,

I would not say that I am a fan of either, but as Terrence has stated - I agree that the intergration argument is a very compelling one (especially with current pains of customization with current CMMS). In addition, I do not know what version or level of experience that you have had with SAP or when, but I can tell you that from my perspective they are both closing the gap and have made significant improvements over the past 3-5 years gaining alot of ground in functionality and being much easier to use than they were in the past. Again, I put my disclaimer in that I do NOT have hands on experience with either and this infant like opinion that I am forming is based on other users of the systems (of past few years) and on the sales presentations and demos only...and I think anyone in the maintenance field for any period of time can tell you how much weight they put into sales presentations! Keep you eyes wide open, ask others directly involved and using the products what they think, look for specifics and ask alot of questions!!!

If you have any items that you can specifically say were problematic, lacked funtionality, or were generally a pain, then I would like to hear as much as you care to type. I will more than likely be able to give you a vivid account of what I think in 2-3 years (probably sooner!)

Thanks
RM
Last edited by Registered Member
quote:
seigga813

I'm not able to answer your question, as I have no experience with either product. But offer a suggestion based on my own research.
Oracle has a number of packages including:
Oracle E-business suite,
Oracle Enterprise,
Oracle EnterpriseOne
They do not all have the same functionality.

Therefore, you may want specify, which Oracle package you are discussing, to get reliable feedback.
RM
quote:
Originally posted by CharlieN:
quote:
seigga813

I'm not able to answer your question, as I have no experience with either product. But offer a suggestion based on my own research.
Oracle has a number of packages including:
Oracle E-business suite,
Oracle Enterprise,
Oracle EnterpriseOne
They do not all have the same functionality.

Therefore, you may want specify, which Oracle package you are discussing, to get reliable feedback.


I would say that it is the e-Business suite with the EAM product.
RM
seigga813

Thanks for letting us know what was behind your post - sorry to jump to conculsions. Just goes to show you what happens when you assume.

What about the issue of Net Weaver being ready to go and Fusion "coming soon"?

Is there any issue with "American" software versus Euro Software?

I would also like to pitch that you inlcude Mimosa compliance on your wish list and criteria as well.

Both SAP and Oracle have supported the MIMOSA demonstration at our past conferences and we want to see them both continue to support open standards such as Open O&M. They both talk the talk but we want to see more walking the walk.

Also look for the availability independent 3rd party support and service providers. There is a difference between factory directed/controlled "partners" and independent partners.

Just a few more points to open the discussion some more.

Terry O
RM

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