Asset Condition ManagementPosts About Modal Analysis and Operation Deflection Shape (ODS)
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Asset Condition ManagementPosts About Modal Analysis and Operation Deflection Shape (ODS)
Asset Condition ManagementPosts About Modal Analysis and Operation Deflection Shape (ODS)
What is the vibration frequency of the vertical motion on the I-beam skid? Does it make the speed of the pump shown or something else that shares the skid? Is there a lot of pipe motion as well? Did you inspect all pipe supports and hangers? A 2-step approach could be considered: 1) Epoxy grout under I-beams (possibly raising about 1/2" or more to get suitable grout thickness along with epoxy-set anchor bolts. 2) Cement non-shrink or epoxy (preferred) grout to fill entire I-beam skid frame. [ more ]
That's the ultimate fix which we discussed for all the pump sets originally with the client in regards to their loss of motors and pumps. It is a history of mechanical repair including alignment, sanding down diameters of shafts for interference fit instead of heating coupling bushing in oil bath [ more ]
Considering the obvious (at least to me) problem the movie shows, I am not at all surprised of the history. This could be a classic case history of fixing the root-cause problem to solve all the issues noted. Time will tell Please keep this forum informed of what you find as you go forward. Regards Jim P [ more ]
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Asset Condition ManagementPosts About Modal Analysis and Operation Deflection Shape (ODS)
Hey Jim, Yes... they matched. I have actually modeled this installation in another ODS software (Clear Motion) before and now that I have an ME Scope license I only modeled a portion of the installation so I actually have more data than I need. By importing that extra data which didn't match any points, it created the error message. Was a good learning experience. ME Scope software is so powerful.... amazing tool to have. Glad I have a license now. Thanks and have a good weekend, KB [ more ]
Good to hear. I've done that myself. I try to learn by my mistakes and, if that were true 100% of the time, I would be really "smahht" by now BTW - Did the points/M#'s in question start with where the error code began? J [ more ]
So I found out that this actually wasn't an error, and it wasn't killing my animations. I was bringing in data in the data block that was not assigned to a point.... this created the error message. When I ran my interpolation calculations for each substructure, everything worked out fine. Animations looks great now. Thanks, KB [ more ]
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Asset Condition ManagementPosts About Modal Analysis and Operation Deflection Shape (ODS)
Asset Condition ManagementPosts About Modal Analysis and Operation Deflection Shape (ODS)
Asset Condition ManagementPosts About Modal Analysis and Operation Deflection Shape (ODS)
Asset Condition ManagementPosts About Modal Analysis and Operation Deflection Shape (ODS)
thanks dear dave for useful information [ more ]
http://www.calpoly.edu/~cbirds...ng%20%20Analysis.pdf Top of page 11 Think of it this way, you are comparing two signals and you want to know if the frequency on sensor A is the same as sensor B. IF the frequency is the same coming into both sensors then there should be a coherence value of .95-1.0.....IF the frequency is not the same then coherence could be from .6 to 0..... An indication of a natural frequency in an FRF plot would be a peak present at a given frequency, and at that... [ more ]
Sure, you can do a transfer function of slid (did you mean skid?) compared to pump housing. Coherence is a measure of causality between input and output. Let's say you measure the COH = ~1 between the ?skid? and pump. In this case, the relationship between the two are the same but not sure what useful information that gives me or whether it helps me figure out the problem. As Gary stated, it is used primarily in impact/modal testing to provide confidence in the cause/effect (e.g. impact to... [ more ]
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Asset Condition ManagementPosts About Modal Analysis and Operation Deflection Shape (ODS)
I have done this type of testing on large vertical pumps, but not with ME-Scope. Water inside and outside the pump column adds mass. A rule-of-thumb is to use twice the volume of water inside with same sump level to account for the mass of water outside the column. There can also be a difference in natural frequencies with the impeller support conditions between wet and dry. Pray that the stop logs hold back the water when you are standing knee deep in water, muscles, and gunk while... [ more ]
Hi Jim, Thanks for looking at this and replying. I will most certainly look into the mass of water/ME' Scope issue. I am curious about this as well. The guy we've hired to do this testing is one of the best at Modal/ODS that I know of and has years and years of experience so I am the results we will get are as accurate as possible. Like you said, we will be using a combination of coast down testing, ODS, and Modal data to try to narrow down where those frequencies are and how much they shift... [ more ]
If I'm not mistaken, Vibrant Technologies has a version of MeScope that allows the user to input variables (e.g. mass of water) and make assessments of what you are looking for. You might want to contact them directly. For the modal test, are you impacting above ground and obtaining response data from the support column below ground? I've not done that but would be very curious how well the data comes out. So when the ODS is performed (now there is the added mass of the water in the wetted... [ more ]
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Asset Condition ManagementPosts About Modal Analysis and Operation Deflection Shape (ODS)
Asset Condition ManagementPosts About Modal Analysis and Operation Deflection Shape (ODS)
hi tony, i am using me scope ves software for ods. how large structures are built in structure .. i am unable to find full fledges tools for creating the models.. is there any other software so that we can build structures there and import to me scope...please help [ more ]
Hi Tony: That rotating ball mill is a thing of beauty! How do you animate the rotating cylinder? Is the movement on the left rotating ring interpolated? [ more ]
Josh, I did not see your question until now. I did not find anything unusual with the ball mill ODS. I was looking for loose bolted joints and fractures at concrete pour joints. I have reposted the movie. The movie in my original post was corrupted and did not play completely. Also included in the zip file is another ODS of a different ball mill that had a concrete fracture as well as loose or stretched bolts below the pinion bearing. Call if I can help. [ more ]
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Asset Condition ManagementPosts About Modal Analysis and Operation Deflection Shape (ODS)
Soft Bearing Balancing Machines 1.PRQ Series soft bearing balancing machines are specially designed for high precision dynamic balancing test of micro-motor rotors 2.The system adopts DC variable speed drive device,realize stepless speed regulation 3.Bracket system uses soft bearing structure,high sensitive sensor,which achieve higher measurement accuracy. 4.Equip with advanced measuring system.Friendly man-machine interface,easy operation.It's highly praised by majority of end-users... [ more ]
Think in turbochargers of cars engines a truck engines. [ more ]
Hi Chiappero, Could you give me some understanding on the machine, eg. turbocharger:Size n capacity need to be addressed?Design is one thing but getting to get it work is most essential.Please include some of your previous turbocharger pictures as an example. [ more ]
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Asset Condition ManagementPosts About Modal Analysis and Operation Deflection Shape (ODS)
Asset Condition ManagementPosts About Modal Analysis and Operation Deflection Shape (ODS)
Hi Nicolas, I like Jim's post here with regard to your question - in particular 400 lines of resolution being applied - definitely more than enough resolution and huge time saving. For baseplates and larger surfaces I have use a small fractional hp variable rpm d/c motor. I have a fly-wheel type rotor fitted to the shaft with a known amount of unbalance weight to create vibration. I place the motor in position - secure it and begin tuning (via attached rheostat controller) through different... [ more ]
regarding the impact test, spend some time bumping the machine in different locations while moving the accel. Watch the response in all three axis and eventually you will be able to determine a good driving point for the entire test. Once you find the driving point that excites all your measurement points in each planer you can use that for the fixed location. I usually use 400 lines for a 200hz fmax. that gives you frequency resolution of 30 lines which is more than adequate resolution and... [ more ]
Reciprocity is a true property. After all we measure magnitudes ratio and relative phase. I prefer to use roving accelerometer for the following reason: one wants to make sure that he is NOT impacting a node prior to the test. Once you have verified that it is not the case and you ARE in fact inparting energy, you can proceed with the test. Fixed impact location also is convenient to ensure that direction of impact has components in all 3 axes. [ more ]
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Asset Condition ManagementPosts About Modal Analysis and Operation Deflection Shape (ODS)
you want to place a brace at an antinode. determining which bending mode will come down to the frequency at which the component is vibrating. If you have determined there is 3 bending modes on a pump discharge pipe. Say the first is at 1700cpm, the second occurs at 2250cpm and the third at 3890cpm. The motor driving the pump is on a VFD and has an operating range from 1500 to 1785RPM. Measured vibration on the pipe is highest when machine shaft speed approaches 1700RPM. In this case the 1st... [ more ]
Changing stiffness, mass, or damping at a node point would not significantly affect natural frequencies or vibration levels at that point or other parts of the structure. Walt [ more ]
The word "node" is a corruption of "no displacement". So there is no movement at a node. Therefore there is not going to be a benefit to making a change (other than perhaps a mass change) to a node. Best regards, Tom Murphy [ more ]
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Asset Condition ManagementPosts About Modal Analysis and Operation Deflection Shape (ODS)
I have been using the Vibxpert to complete ODS and Modal projects in MEscope for a few years. I have used this on mostly pumps and motors and their supporting structure. Some of the larger project required several hundred measurement points. I have used the current line drive accelerometers that come with the VXP and aftermarket ICP accelerometers receiving good results with both. Since the device is only 2 channels it takes a while to complete data collection. X Y and Z has to be recorded... [ more ]
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Asset Condition ManagementPosts About Modal Analysis and Operation Deflection Shape (ODS)
Structural Health Monitoring is monitoring a structure (like a bridge, building or dam} for changes that may indicate damage or degradation of that structure. While the structure is static, it is subjected to dynamic forces; wind will blow over the bridge or against the building, waves will hit the dam or oil platform, cars will also drive across bridges. These dynamic forces will excite vibrations in the structure. The forces excite modes of vibration in the structure and Structural Health... [ more ]
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Asset Condition ManagementPosts About Modal Analysis and Operation Deflection Shape (ODS)
Asset Condition ManagementPosts About Modal Analysis and Operation Deflection Shape (ODS)
could you please expalain the procedure and analysis by using MS excel ODS ,Do need full. Thanks in advance . [ more ]
Thak you very much. Kind regards [ more ]
I use MS Excel to plot mode shapes. It is not for animation or for 3D, but it it works well for basic machine structures. If you already have Excel, then it is "free"! Walt [ more ]
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Asset Condition ManagementPosts About Modal Analysis and Operation Deflection Shape (ODS)
CsI 2115 can collect Phase data , i have not used but we have the option Phase analysis in our instrument . could you please explain the procedure step by step . [ more ]
My understanding is that the CSI-2115 analyzer can measure shaft speed and phase. Here is a link to an old paper describing the 2115 for balancing: http://www.osti.gov/scitech/biblio/552750/ Kishore, if the vibration frequency of interest is at 1x shaft speed, then you can do ODS test with 2115 by measuring shaft speed (tachometer connected to BNC on analyzer) and vibration amplitude filtered at 1x shaft speed. I use Excel Scatter Plot to make scaled X-Y plots of vibration amplitude and... [ more ]
If I recall correctly, the 2115 will not collect phase data, just velocity and peakvue. You need to have an analyzer that has the ability to collect phase data with a strobe/photo cell/laser/2nd channel as the trigger Dave [ more ]
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Asset Condition ManagementPosts About Modal Analysis and Operation Deflection Shape (ODS)
Asset Condition ManagementPosts About Modal Analysis and Operation Deflection Shape (ODS)
Asset Condition ManagementPosts About Modal Analysis and Operation Deflection Shape (ODS)
Asset Condition ManagementPosts About Modal Analysis and Operation Deflection Shape (ODS)
Asset Condition ManagementPosts About Modal Analysis and Operation Deflection Shape (ODS)
As I surfed the literature, it appears that during the modal test one would want to replicate as close as possible the actual operating conditions of an object. For instance, an aircraft should be suspended using soft ropes; on another hand, a heavy impeller should NOT be tested in soft suspenders, but rather with the shaft in the bearings which approximates fixed points condition. The softness of the ropes and stiffness of the attachment should meet certain condition for accuracy, of course. [ more ]
You can find a brief entry in Hartog's book on vibration. Campbell's paper uses it. [ more ]
Thanks guys for your responses. No, I am not doing an EMA in order to compare the results with FEA. I think EMA can stand on its own. I would like to use EMA to prove that the crack pattern developed in the impeller is due to the excitation of a specific modal frequency. The drawback of an EMA test however is that it is static. A non spinning impeller will have some modal parameters affected by additional stiffness due to spinning. I guess Southwell's Theorem talks specifically about that. [ more ]
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Asset Condition ManagementPosts About Modal Analysis and Operation Deflection Shape (ODS)
Asset Condition ManagementPosts About Modal Analysis and Operation Deflection Shape (ODS)
Just an update, I solved my issue, you have to use the correct two channel splitter for that port I.E the gray and black one, the other one will not work. [ more ]
I am a little confused on this as well, I have the triax set up an channels a,b,c and a accelerometer via the two channel splitter cable set up on D, but when I go to take a measurement it says on of the transducers is not connected, any ideas? [ more ]
Well, I not did it by myself, but yes connect it using the "C - D" Splitter and other Turck. Konstantin [ more ]
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Asset Condition ManagementPosts About Modal Analysis and Operation Deflection Shape (ODS)
I totally agree with Testtech. If you picture a structure in 3D as series of interconnected mass-spring elements and assuming that glue vs. metal element stiffness are drastically different, it will become clear that modal parameters will also be different. To verify this concept, you can do a quick modal test on a metal bar; then cut it, glue the halves together using, say, locktite glue, and test again. I predict hugh difference. [ more ]
Seems unlikely. I guess you have to believe that the elastic modulus of the glued joint is similar to that of the solid metal. Do you have reason to believe that? [ more ]
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Asset Condition ManagementPosts About Modal Analysis and Operation Deflection Shape (ODS)
Software for ODS called Me'Scope But if you have CSI 2130 you also need ODS DLP and special option for AMS MHM called Advanced Vibration Analysis Software (included in MHM Platinum). There was package included all parts called "Master Vibration Expert Package for A2130". Accels and Modal Hammers need to be choosen according objects to get Shapes of. Regards, Kos [ more ]
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Asset Condition ManagementPosts About Modal Analysis and Operation Deflection Shape (ODS)
Asset Condition ManagementPosts About Modal Analysis and Operation Deflection Shape (ODS)
Ron, Performed modal analysis on impellor with the shaft. Animation looks stunning. If interested I can email the avi file to a private address. [ more ]
Dave, If your major concern is the tiny raised blades on a high speed wheel, the influence of the shaft is probably insignificant. If you care about the modes of the wheel itself, 1D, 2D, etc. then the shaft is necessary. I would still do all testing with the shaft since it is the true platform the impeller will work from. Ron Brook [ more ]
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Asset Condition ManagementPosts About Modal Analysis and Operation Deflection Shape (ODS)
Thanks I did end up using a shape table because my cross channel spectrum for ODS is not enabled in my vb7 and it is an older instrument with out a USB port for down loading UFF data. Worked very well, just had to input data manually regards Gary [ more ]
Hi Gary, I might have misread your question, but there is an option for 'cross spectrum' in ME'Scope trace window. If you want to import ODS phase and magnitude data that you collected at a single frequency you can do that in a shape table instead of a trace. Hope this helps! Gerard [ more ]
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Asset Condition ManagementPosts About Modal Analysis and Operation Deflection Shape (ODS)
Thanks for that Dave, I have read a bit further on and can see how this relates. [ more ]
Yes, HVA or XYZ at each measurement location. While standing at the back of the machine, looking toward the machine, the right hand side is positive and the left hand side is negative, depending on how you mount your sensor. So if you collect Z and the sensor is pointing away from you call it positive Z, while standing in the same location and the sensor is pointing toward you then it is a negative Z. Dave [ more ]
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Asset Condition ManagementPosts About Modal Analysis and Operation Deflection Shape (ODS)
Asset Condition ManagementPosts About Modal Analysis and Operation Deflection Shape (ODS)
Jim, No, I don't think anyone stole it. I was just hoping someone found it and then asked someone they knew that was into Modal/ODS what the heck it was for. I know I will find it in the last place I look! [ more ]
You don't think someone on this forum took it do you? Come on people, fess up A while back I couldn't find my MeScope key either for a few hours till I found it where I last put it. Funny how that happens. I then attached a tel # tag on the end with a note of an reward for return. Lets hope I never have to rely on it... Jim P [ more ]
Danny, I took such good care of that of that key. I kept it in the same pouch in my computer bag as my passport. Loaded up a new computer one day with the software and went to get the key....no can find. I am awaiting my next ODS/Modal job and then it will cost the customer approx. $2300.00 more. [ more ]
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Asset Condition ManagementPosts About Modal Analysis and Operation Deflection Shape (ODS)
Thanks Tony! [ more ]
Following up on your question and BrookieG's reply... Units for Force, Mass and Length are set in ME'scope by selecting FILE then STRUCTURE OPTIONS and choosing the UNITS tab. Be sure to click the "Save as Default" button on the same screen once you have made your choices. It is also possible to draw your structure from photographs or by using a third party Photo Realistic Modeling software program. I mostly use the drawing assistant program within ME'scope and I am satisifed with my... [ more ]
Hi, yes you can draw to scale in whatever unit prefer in MEscope. Depending on the effort you want to put into it you can add skins to models to make them look highly detailed. Have a look at their website. Seems like a bit too much trouble for me though Hope this was at all useful Gerard [ more ]
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Asset Condition ManagementPosts About Modal Analysis and Operation Deflection Shape (ODS)
Good job on your first modal project. Don't hesitate to call or write if I can help with any questions you may have on ODS or Modal technique or software. [ more ]
Well it actually went pretty smoothly. Go easy as this was our first try at it. There's probably more detailI would add next time, but for a first try we kept things a bit more simple. Check out the video let me know what you think. [ more ]
http://www.vibetech.com/go.cfm/en-us/content/support Top right corner of this webpage are links to additional resources Dave [ more ]
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Asset Condition ManagementPosts About Modal Analysis and Operation Deflection Shape (ODS)
Asset Condition ManagementPosts About Modal Analysis and Operation Deflection Shape (ODS)
We currently do not do ODS, But we are actually getting ME'Scope installed and are soon going to be tapping into the power of that tool. Hope to be able to contribute to this part of the forums soon. [ more ]
After rereading this post, maybe I should use the term "advanced" technique ie. the extension of phase analysis. [ more ]
Hi Josh, if you are using "relative" in a geological term, then perhaps yes. I have read documents dating back 50 years using this technique. I first put my hands on software for this in 1988 - then using an HP300 series computer with an IEEE interface to a spectrum analyser. The hardware took a leap forward about 4 years later and the only real changes since then seem to be just at the edges. It is an extremely useful tool and I have helped baffled engineers solve many problems with it. Tom [ more ]
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Asset Condition ManagementPosts About Modal Analysis and Operation Deflection Shape (ODS)
Tony, your name is too long. Pls shorten it to avoid scrolling too many times when reading long posts. [ more ]
Hello VRG ODS testing is able to identify a wide variety of mechanical faults and resonance issues such as looseness, soft foot, broken welds, misalignment, unbalance, bending resonance modes, torsional resonance modes, structural weakness and foundation problems. The ODS doesn’t care if the machine problem is non-linear like a broken weld or loose bolt. ODS shows everything that is happening on the machine. The ODS animation will show the antinode lines in the animation when you turn on the... [ more ]
Dear Tony The ODS animations are really good. I am not an expert on ODS or Modal analysis. I always wonder that how, ODS, which I believe ( pl correct me if wrong ), only shows how a machine is moving ( dancing ) help a customer to solve structural problems. It does not give me nodes / antinodes which are required to decide where to stiffen and where not. MEscope has some advanced softwares which also gives solution as to where and howmuch stiffening is required to solve problem. What I want... [ more ]
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Asset Condition ManagementPosts About Modal Analysis and Operation Deflection Shape (ODS)
Hello Old Friend- I too would suggest Tony. He's excellent. Also, there is another guy that I know that may be able to help. 1) You can email me - Keith F. has my email address. 2) You can come to the Vib Inst meeting this Thursday (4-26-12) and I will introduce you to the guy I know. 3) You can hire me to come and train your group on ME'scope and how to use it. Drop me an email sometime - we can catch up. Jeremy Cole [ more ]
Hopefully we can breath some life back into this topic area of the forums. I am looking forward to expanding into this more specialized area of vibration work. Thanks again for everyones perspectives and suggestions. [ more ]
Torptorp, As is true with most everything else, you can read the user's manual and make the technology physically work. However, it doesn't necessarily make you good at what you do. I agree with the training upfront to establish good practices. I would also recommend continuing to discuss methodology and findings either on this board, with carefully chosen "mentors" or both. I've seen my share of poor ODS and Modal projects (whether it was poor planning or a complete lack of understanding of... [ more ]
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Asset Condition ManagementPosts About Modal Analysis and Operation Deflection Shape (ODS)
Thanks for your help.Aubrey [ more ]
I think I understand what you are talking about now. I have a very limited experience with ODS but here is my $.02. As you are saying, setup a either a tachometer, if you want to animate at machine speed or a whole multiple, or a reference accelerometer. If you are using the reference accelerometer. set it on a point that gives you the best signal of that frequency. Sometimes the greatest amplitude is not the best if the signal comes and goes. I was once taking a readings on a screw conveyor... [ more ]
Thanks Aubrey. I do not understand it. What I want to know how to make a ODS with atriaxial accelerometer, a uniaxial accelerometer and a four-channel analyzer. And how to select an appropriate reference. Thanks [ more ]
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Asset Condition ManagementPosts About Modal Analysis and Operation Deflection Shape (ODS)
Dave Thanks for the response. I knew the software was SUPPOSED to import this file extension but got a non-descript "Cannot import" error message. I will see if I can get some support and will post back if I have any luck THANKS JP [ more ]
http://www.vibetech.com/go.cfm.../mescope-file-import It appears they support your file extension Not sure if you are still under annual support agreement or not, here is how to contact support http://www.vibetech.com/go.cfm...us/content/contactus Dave [ more ]
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Asset Condition ManagementPosts About Modal Analysis and Operation Deflection Shape (ODS)
ODS is more involved than reading a tutorial. If you purchased MeScope through Emerson, it should have come with training. Contact Tony Dematteo with 4X Diagnostics. [ more ]
http://maintenanceforums.com/e...004131/m/64420271663 [ more ]
http://www.vibetech.com/go.cfm.../content/training/x? [ more ]
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Asset Condition ManagementPosts About Modal Analysis and Operation Deflection Shape (ODS)
Sorry for disappearance. I am back from surgery. I'll get an animation done as soon as I can. [ more ]
Dave, Thanks for the info. I have just send him a message. [ more ]
Just an FYI, Dan Ambre of Full Spectrum Diagnostics would be able to solve this issue or assist you in finding the problem. They too are located in MN... Dave [ more ]
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Asset Condition ManagementPosts About Modal Analysis and Operation Deflection Shape (ODS)
Hi, Thanks dear Jon, I will attend your comment, Thank you for bubble chart. [ more ]
Hi Kiavash, Please verify your accelerometer orientation. When I did the preceeding animation, I assumed some of your readings were taken with the acceleromter normal to the surface. This will change some of the phase readings 180. An easy way to document this is to place arrows showing the normal directions. If the accelerometer is placed opposite to your established norm, the phase reading should be corrected. If the reading is more than 180°, subtract 180°. If the reading is less than... [ more ]
Dear Jon McFadden, Please Simulate this data, This is more complete, Tell your analysis please [ more ]
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Asset Condition ManagementPosts About Modal Analysis and Operation Deflection Shape (ODS)
Asset Condition ManagementPosts About Modal Analysis and Operation Deflection Shape (ODS)
Hi Alok, I was hoping someone with a 2130 would answer your questions. I use a CSI 2120-2 data collector. I use the Advanced 2-Channel DLP to do the data collection. The 2120-2 can't store cross phase data without the DLP. I have a PCB modal hammer. Vibrant Tech's ME'scope-VES is the animation software I use. I would assume the 2130 would require it's version of the Advanced 2-channel DLP in order to store the cross phase data. Someone with a 2130 can answer your question with better... [ more ]
THE ODS/MODAL Analysis seems to be useful in old Steel Plant where equipments are in deformed condition due to various types of catastrophic failures of equipment. We have CSI-2130 data collector. It has softwares of it. Please advise whether I should go for upgrading the 2130. Please give idea about seperate machine to be purchased or 2130 will be useful. [ more ]
Hi Steve, Did you get the label problem figured out? Can you post the video with the <animate><contours><fill> and <values> turned "ON"? I am curious about the amplitude of the possible mode shape. [ more ]
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